When AI Agents Take Over, What Does a Post-Human Economy Look Like?
Thank you to our sponsors!
Fuse
In one week, OpenClaw agents have gotten their own social networking platform, launched cryptocurrency tokens and built a site to rent humans.
In this episode of Unchained, DAIS Global Chair Michael Casey and The Exponentialist co-founder David Mattin explore what Moltbook reveals about the direction of the AI trend, how AI could impact jobs and what a post-human economy looks like. Will Bitcoin be the currency of the future?
Don't miss Michael's sovereign AI thesis and how Mattin believes we can navigate the transition to a post-human society.
Hint: “lean into your weirdness.”
Guests:
Michael Casey, Chairman of DAIS Global
David Mattin, Co-founder of The Exponentialist
Links:
How Nansen’s New Trading Agent Makes It Easier to Follow the Smart Money Onchain
How the x402 Standard Is Enabling AI Agents to Pay Each Other
Check out David's newsletter New World Same Humans
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
The 3 Laws of Knowledge [César Hidalgo]
César Hidalgo has spent years trying to answer a deceptively simple question: What is knowledge, and why is it so hard to move around?
We all have this intuition that knowledge is just... information. Write it down in a book, upload it to GitHub, train an AI on it—done. But César argues that's completely wrong. Knowledge isn't a thing you can copy and paste. It's more like a living organism that needs the right environment, the right people, and constant exercise to survive.
Guest: César Hidalgo, Director of the Center for Collective Learning
1. Knowledge Follows Laws (Like Physics)
2. You Can't Download Expertise
3. Why Big Companies Fail to Adapt
4. The "Infinite Alphabet" of Economies
If you think AI can just "copy" human knowledge, or that development is just about throwing money at poor countries, or that writing things down preserves them forever—this conversation will change your mind. Knowledge is fragile, specific, and collective. It decays fast if you don't use it.
The Infinite Alphabet [César A. Hidalgo]
https://www.penguin.co.uk/books/458054/the-infinite-alphabet-by-hidalgo-cesar-a/9780241655672
https://x.com/cesifoti
Rescript link.
https://app.rescript.info/public/share/eaBHbEo9xamwbwpxzcVVm4NQjMh7lsOQKeWwNxmw0JQ
---
TIMESTAMPS:
00:00:00 The Three Laws of Knowledge
00:02:28 Rival vs. Non-Rival: The Economics of Ideas
00:05:43 Why You Can't Just 'Download' Knowledge
00:08:11 The Detective Novel Analogy
00:11:54 Collective Learning & Organizational Networks
00:16:27 Architectural Innovation: Amazon vs. Barnes & Noble
00:19:15 The First Law: Learning Curves
00:23:05 The Samuel Slater Story: Treason & Memory
00:28:31 Physics of Knowledge: Joule's Cannon
00:32:33 Extensive vs. Intensive Properties
00:35:45 Knowledge Decay: Ise Temple & Polaroid
00:41:20 Absorptive Capacity: Sony & Donetsk
00:47:08 Disruptive Innovation & S-Curves
00:51:23 Team Size & The Cost of Innovation
00:57:13 Geography of Knowledge: Vespa's Origin
01:04:34 Migration, Diversity & 'Planet China'
01:12:02 Institutions vs. Knowledge: The China Story
01:21:27 Economic Complexity & The Infinite Alphabet
01:32:27 Do LLMs Have Knowledge?
---
REFERENCES:
Book:
[00:47:45] The Innovator's Dilemma (Christensen)
https://www.amazon.com/Innovators-Dilemma-Revolutionary-Change-Business/dp/0062060244
[00:55:15] Why Greatness Cannot Be Planned
https://amazon.com/dp/3319155237
[01:35:00] Why Information Grows
https://amazon.com/dp/0465048994
Paper:
[00:03:15] Endogenous Technological Change (Romer, 1990)
https://web.stanford.edu/~klenow/Romer_1990.pdf
[00:03:30] A Model of Growth Through Creative Destruction (Aghion & Howitt, 1992)
https://dash.harvard.edu/server/api/core/bitstreams/7312037d-2b2d-6bd4-e053-0100007fdf3b/content
[00:14:55] Organizational Learning: From Experience to Knowledge (Argote & Miron-Spektor, 2011)
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/228754233_Organizational_Learning_From_Experience_to_Knowledge
[00:17:05] Architectural Innovation (Henderson & Clark, 1990)
https://www.researchgate.net/publication/200465578_Architectural_Innovation_The_Reconfiguration_of_Existing_Product_Technologies_and_the_Failure_of_Established_Firms
[00:19:45] The Learning Curve Equation (Thurstone, 1916)
https://dn790007.ca.archive.org/0/items/learningcurveequ00thurrich/learningcurveequ00thurrich.pdf
[00:21:30] Factors Affecting the Cost of Airplanes (Wright, 1936)
https://pdodds.w3.uvm.edu/research/papers/others/1936/wright1936a.pdf
[00:52:45] Are Ideas Getting Harder to Find? (Bloom et al.)
https://web.stanford.edu/~chadj/IdeaPF.pdf
[01:33:00] LLMs/ Emergence
https://arxiv.org/abs/2506.11135
Person:
[00:25:30] Samuel Slater
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samuel_Slater
[00:42:05] Masaru Ibuka (Sony)
https://www.sony.com/en/SonyInfo/CorporateInfo/History/SonyHistory/1-02.html
Yaniv Altshuler: reducing cow methane emissions with AI
Yaniv Altshuler, MIT Media Lab researcher, joins Pieter Abbeel to discuss reducing cow methane emissions with AI and more.
Subscribe to the Robot Brains Podcast today | Visit therobotbrains.ai and follow us on YouTube at TheRobotBrainsPodcast and Twitter at @pabbeel.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
#329 – Kate Darling: Social Robots, Ethics, Privacy and the Future of MIT
Kate Darling is a researcher at MIT Media Lab interested in human robot interaction and robot ethics. Please support this podcast by checking out our sponsors:
– True Classic Tees: https://trueclassictees.com/lex and use code LEX to get 25% off
– Shopify: https://shopify.com/lex to get 14-day free trial
– Linode: https://linode.com/lex to get $100 free credit
– InsideTracker: https://insidetracker.com/lex to get 20% off
– ExpressVPN: https://expressvpn.com/lexpod to get 3 months free
EPISODE LINKS:
Kate’s Twitter: http://twitter.com/grok_
Kate’s Website: http://katedarling.org
Kate’s Instagram: http://www.instagram.com/grok_
The New Breed (book): https://amzn.to/3ExhBuf
Creativity without Law (book): https://amzn.to/3MqV5F3
LuLaRobot (paper): http://drive.google.com/file/d/1PtYpkDQaQVPbhQIc6wcCC50JKWVsDo3k/view
PODCAST INFO:
Podcast website: https://lexfridman.com/podcast
Apple Podcasts: https://apple.co/2lwqZIr
Spotify: https://spoti.fi/2nEwCF8
RSS: https://lexfridman.com/feed/podcast/
YouTube Full Episodes: https://youtube.com/lexfridman
YouTube Clips: https://youtube.com/lexclips
SUPPORT & CONNECT:
– Check out the sponsors above, it’s the best way to support this podcast
– Support on Patreon: https://www.patreon.com/lexfridman
– Twitter: https://twitter.com/lexfridman
– Instagram: https://www.instagram.com/lexfridman
– LinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/lexfridman
– Facebook: https://www.facebook.com/lexfridman
– Medium: https://medium.com/@lexfridman
OUTLINE:
Here’s the timestamps for the episode. On some podcast players you should be able to click the timestamp to jump to that time.
(00:00) – Introduction
(07:57) – What is a robot?
(23:57) – Metaverse
(33:19) – Bias in robots
(47:02) – Modern robotics
(49:34) – Automation
(53:57) – Autonomous driving
(1:02:22) – Privacy
(1:05:48) – Google’s LaMDA
(1:10:35) – Robot animal analogy
(1:23:38) – Data concerns
(1:41:40) – Humanoid robots
(2:00:42) – LuLaRobot
(2:09:36) – Ethics in robotics
(2:24:57) – Jeffrey Epstein
(2:58:31) – Love and relationships
Special Episode: Recipes for Future Plagues
In this episode of the podcast, Rob Reid and Kevin Esvelt discuss USAID's new "Deep VZN" program, which aims to discover new pandemic-grade viruses and publish their genomes to the world. Esvelt estimates that there are currently around 30,000 people who could then easily build them.
If the Making Sense podcast logo in your player is BLACK, you can SUBSCRIBE to gain access to all full-length episodes at samharris.org/subscribe.
Learning how to train your mind is the single greatest investment you can make in life. That's why Sam Harris created the Waking Up app. From rational mindfulness practice to lessons on some of life's most important topics, join Sam as he demystifies the practice of meditation and explores the theory behind it.
Why Bitcoin Now: Michael Casey and Niall Ferguson on How Bitcoin Fits in the History of Money - Ep.181
Niall Ferguson, Milbank Family Senior Fellow at the Hoover Institution at Stanford University, and the author of numerous books including The Ascent of Money: A Financial History of the World and most recently, the Square and the Tower: Networks and Power from the Freemasons to Facebook, and Michael Casey, chief content officer at CoinDesk and coauthor of two books on crypto, The Age of Cryptocurrency and The Truth Machine, discuss the history of money and the macro environment for Bitcoin. We cover:
how they became involved in crypto
historically, what has made things money, or how people have decided that something is money
the difficulty of managing fiat currency
modern monetary theory and the role of the state in the financial system
Satoshi’s message in BTC’s genesis block and what that indicates about Satoshi's intentions with Bitcoin
whether a more transparent, blockchain-based financial system could eventually lead to a new financial order
how Bitcoin behaves like an option on digital gold, and when it will behave like digital gold
whether Bitcoin is simply a reversion to previous forms of money that weren’t controlled by the state
how crypto/blockchain and fintech innovation from startups and the Chinese government will affect the USD
how a hypothetical war between the US and China would affect the dollar's dominance
how China's DCEP could disintermediate banks
how Bitcoin fits into all of the different macro conditions facing the global economy
whether Libra is going to be the initial gateway getting people into our digital currency world
how well the recovery from coronavirus will go, and how it will affect the development of the crypto space in the near-term
Thank you to our sponsors!
Crypto.com: https://crypto.com
Tezos: https://tquorum.com/
Episode links:
Niall Ferguson: http://www.niallferguson.com
The Ascent of Money: https://www.penguinrandomhouse.com/books/302900/the-ascent-of-money-by-niall-ferguson/
Michael Casey: https://www.michaeljcasey.com
Money Reimagined: https://www.coindesk.com/tag/money-reimagined
The Age of Cryptocurrency: https://us.macmillan.com/books/9781250081551
The first episode in the Why Bitcoin Now series: Mike Novogratz and Raoul Pal on 'the Single Greatest Brand' ofo the Last 10 Years: https://unchainedpodcast.com/why-bitcoin-now-mike-novogratz-and-raoul-pal-on-the-single-greatest-brand-of-the-last-10-years/
How Niall got into Bitcoin:
http://www.niallferguson.com/journalism/finance-economics/bitcoin-may-go-pop-but-its-revolution-will-go-on
Niall and Michael at Consensus: https://www.coindesk.com/disruption-money-and-a-world-of-change-feat-niall-ferguson
Unchained interview with Chamath Palihapitiya, who believes Bitcoin is a hedge on everything blowing up: https://unchainedpodcast.com/chamath-palihapitiya-why-bitcoin-will-be-the-category-winner/
Carlota Perez at CoinDesk's Consensus: https://www.coindesk.com/video/carlota-perez-on-blockchains-and-technological-revolutions
Unchained interview about the DCEP: https://unchainedpodcast.com/why-china-aims-to-replace-cash-with-the-digital-yuan/
Unchained interview with Christopher Giancarlo about a digital dollar: https://unchainedpodcast.com/christopher-giancarlo-why-the-us-needs-to-have-a-digital-dollar/
Unconfirmed episode with Michael about Libra: https://unchainedpodcast.com/why-it-would-be-good-if-libra-rivaled-the-us-dollar/
Unchained episode with a co-creator of Libra: https://unchainedpodcast.com/a-libra-co-creator-on-how-facebook-will-make-money-from-calibra/
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Why we have an emotional connection to robots | Kate Darling
We're far from developing robots that feel emotions, but we already have feelings towards them, says robot ethicist Kate Darling, and an instinct like that can have consequences. Learn more about how we're biologically hardwired to project intent and life onto machines -- and how it might help us better understand ourselves.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Say Yes to the AI Dress: Entrepreneur Brings GPUs to Fashion - Ep. 98
In the future imagined by Pinar Yanardag, a postdoctoral research associate at MIT Media Lab, AI will collaborate with humans, not replace them. This is the concept behind her project, “How to Generate (Almost) Anything,” which she created with other students from the MIT Media Lab and professionals in the Boston area. Yanardag sat down with AI Podcast host Noah Kravitz to talk about this project, along with her other new creations.
Human-Robot Interaction and Empathy with Kate Darling - TWIML Talk #289
Today we’re joined by Dr. Kate Darling, Research Specialist at the MIT Media Lab. Kate’s focus is on robot ethics, the social implication of how people treat robots and the purposeful design of robots in our daily lives. We discuss measuring empathy, the impact of robot treatment on kids behavior, the correlation between animals and robots, and why 'effective' robots aren’t always humanoid. Kate combines a wealth of knowledge with an analytical mind that questions the why and how of human-robot intera
Recode Decode: MIT Media Lab director Joi Ito
Joichi "Joi" Ito, the director of the MIT Media Lab, talks with Recode's Kara Swisher about engineers who over-simplify the world's problems, the Media Lab's role in "surveillance capitalism," and why the values of the tech world will shift from within.
In this episode: Ito's background and what the Media Lab does; techno-utopianism and the early days of the internet; how Ito got to MIT; computers implanted in the human body; Shoshana Zuboff and "surveillance capitalism"; the gap between technology and the law; why we're not living in a simulation; what’s missing from the AI discourse; the problem with how tech solves problems; the dangers of bad policy; and the subordination of liberal arts at schools like MIT.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices
Rosalind Picard: Affective Computing, Emotion, Privacy, and Health
Rosalind Picard is a professor at MIT, director of the Affective Computing Research Group at the MIT Media Lab, and co-founder of two companies, Affectiva and Empatica. Over two decades ago she launched the field of affective computing with her book of the same name. This book described the importance of emotion in artificial and natural intelligence, the vital role emotion communication has to relationships between people in general and in human-robot interaction. If you would like to get more information about this podcast go to https://lexfridman.com/ai or connect with @lexfridman on Twitter, LinkedIn, Facebook, Medium, or YouTube where you can watch the video versions of these conversations.
Open or closed? The answer is both, w/Joi Ito
No organization that’s entirely closed — or entirely open — can scale as successfully as an organization that combines both. Yes, it invites a bit of chaos – but chaos breeds innovation. Joi Ito has spent his career championing radically open systems, from Creative Commons to cyber currency. As a past director of the famed MIT Media Lab, he focused on facilitating conversations that keep pace with the shifting challenges we face in our companies, institutions and societies. Cameo appearance: Megan Smith (former U.S. Chief Technology Officer).
Subscribe to the Masters of Scale weekly newsletter: https://mastersofscale.com/subscribe
See Privacy Policy at https://art19.com/privacy and California Privacy Notice at https://art19.com/privacy#do-not-sell-my-info.
An AI smartwatch that detects seizures and saves lives | Rosalind Picard
Every year worldwide, more than 50,000 otherwise healthy people with epilepsy suddenly die. These deaths may be largely preventable, says AI researcher Rosalind Picard. Learn how Picard helped develop a cutting-edge smartwatch that can detect epileptic seizures before they occur -- and alert nearby loved ones in time to help them.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
A bold idea to replace politicians | César Hidalgo
CésarHidalgo has a radical suggestion for fixing our broken political system: automate it! In this provocative talk, he outlines a bold idea to bypass politicians by empowering citizens to create personalized AI representatives that participate directly in democratic decisions. Explore a new way to make collective decisions and expand your understanding of democracy.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
a16z Podcast: To All the Robots I've Loved Before
with Kate Darling (@grok_) and Hanne Tidnam (@omnivorousread)
We already know that we have an innate tendency to anthropomorphize robots. But beyond just projecting human qualities onto them, as we begin to share more and more spaces, social and private, what kind of relationships will we develop with them? And how will those relationships in turn change us?
In this Valentine’s Day special, Kate Darling, Researcher at MIT Labs, talks with a16z's Hanne Tidnam all about our emotional relations with robots. From our lighter sides -- affection, love, empathy, and support -- to our darker sides, what will these new kinds of relationships enhance or de-sensitize in us? Why does it matter that we develop these often intense attachments to these machines that range from tool to companion -- and what do these relationships teach us about ourselves, our tendencies and our behaviors? What kinds of models from the past can we look towards to help us navigate the ethics and accountability that come along with these increasingly sophisticated relationships with robots?
Stay Updated:
Find a16z on YouTube: YouTube
Find a16z on X
Find a16z on LinkedIn
Listen to the a16z Show on Spotify
Listen to the a16z Show on Apple Podcasts
Follow our host: https://twitter.com/eriktorenberg
Please note that the content here is for informational purposes only; should NOT be taken as legal, business, tax, or investment advice or be used to evaluate any investment or security; and is not directed at any investors or potential investors in any a16z fund. a16z and its affiliates may maintain investments in the companies discussed. For more details please see a16z.com/disclosures.
Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.
Teaching AI to Preschoolers with Randi Williams - TWiML Talk #225
Today, in the first episode of our Black in AI series, we’re joined by Randi Williams, PhD student at the MIT Media Lab.
At the Black in AI workshop Randi presented her research on Popbots: A Early Childhood AI Curriculum, which is geared towards teaching preschoolers the fundamentals of artificial intelligence. In our conversation, we discuss the origins of the project, the three AI concepts that are taught in the program, and the goals that Randi hopes to accomplish with her work.
How AI is making it easier to diagnose disease | Pratik Shah
Today's AI algorithms require tens of thousands of expensive medical images to detect a patient's disease. What if we could drastically reduce the amount of data needed to train an AI, making diagnoses low-cost and more effective? TED Fellow Pratik Shah is working on a clever system to do just that. Using an unorthodox AI approach, Shah has developed a technology that requires as few as 50 images to develop a working algorithm -- and can even use photos taken on doctors' cell phones to provide a diagnosis. Learn more about how this new way to analyze medical information could lead to earlier detection of life-threatening illnesses and bring AI-assisted diagnosis to more health care settings worldwide.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
How we'll become cyborgs and extend human potential | Hugh Herr
Humans will soon have new bodies that forever blur the line between the natural and synthetic worlds, says bionics designer Hugh Herr. In an unforgettable talk, he details "NeuroEmbodied Design," a methodology for creating cyborg function that he's developing at MIT, and shows us a future where we've augmented our bodies in a way that will redefine human potential -- and, maybe, turn us into superheroes. "During the twilight years of this century, I believe humans will be unrecognizable in morphology and dynamics from what we are today," Herr says. "Humanity will take flight and soar."
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
How we can use space technology to improve life on Earth | Danielle Wood
Danielle Wood leads the Space Enabled research group at the MIT Media Lab, where she works to tear down the barriers that limit the benefits of space exploration to only the few, the rich or the elite. She identifies six technologies developed for space exploration that can contribute to sustainable development across the world -- from observation satellites that provide information to aid organizations to medical research on microgravity that can be used to improve health care on Earth. "Space truly is useful for sustainable development for the benefit of all peoples," Wood says.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
What moral decisions should driverless cars make? | Iyad Rahwan
Should a driverless car kill you if it means saving five pedestrians? In this primer on the social dilemmas of driverless cars, Iyad Rahwan explores how the technology will challenge our morality and explains his work collecting data from real people on the ethical trade-offs we're willing (and not willing) to make.
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
#66 — Living with Robots
Sam Harris speaks with Kate Darling about the ethical concerns surrounding our increasing use of robots and other autonomous systems.
If the Making Sense podcast logo in your player is BLACK, you can SUBSCRIBE to gain access to all full-length episodes at samharris.org/subscribe.
Smelfies, and other experiments in synthetic biology | Ani Liu
What if you could take a smell selfie, a smelfie? What if you had a lipstick that caused plants to grow where you kiss? Ani Liu explores the intersection of technology and sensory perception, and her work is wedged somewhere between science, design and art. In this swift, smart talk, she shares dreams, wonderings and experiments, asking: What happens when science fiction becomes science fact?
Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.
Why A Wall Street Journal Currency Reporter Didn't Understand Money Until He Learned About Bitcoin
Michael Casey, senior advisor at MIT's Media Lab and author of the Age of Cryptocurrency, spent 18 years at the Wall Street Journal -- a good portion of that covering currency markets. But he says it wasn't until he learned about Bitcoin that he really understood what money was. In this episode of Unchained, he explains why, plus discusses why he thinks China will play a key role in moving the world to a cryptocurrency- or blockchain-based trade settlement system, what that could mean for the U.S. dollar as a reserve currency and what he thinks is the most cutting-edge work being done in blockchain.
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
