Fourteen days. That's the window the crypto industry has to get the CLARITY Act through the Senate — or wait until the 2030s for another shot.The combined draft dropped last week for the first time, merging the Senate Banking and Agriculture committee text into one bill. It added a law enforcement title (the Fraternal Order of Police endorsed it the same day). It added an ethics provision. And Democrats are rejecting that provision outright.This week on The Defiant, we're bringing three people living this fight from the inside: Miller Whitehouse-Levine (Solana Policy Institute), Amanda Tuminelli (DeFi Education Fund), an...
Jake Chervinsky and Amanda Tuminelli join us to unpack the Roman Storm verdict—what it means for DeFi, why Section 1960 is a looming threat to open-source developers, and the strong grounds for appeal.
We discuss the legal, political, and legislative paths forward, the role of Congress in protecting developers, and how the crypto industry can mobilize to prevent future prosecutions.
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TIMESTAMPS
0:00 Intro
0:24 Verdict First Impressions
4:22 Was it Successful?
6:26 Second Trial?
9:47 Money Transmitter Debate
15:20 Optimistic Setup?
19:56 Levels of Precedent
26:04 What’s Next?
30:26 Crypto Industry Agency
34:01 Regulatory Acts
37:33 Two Paths
44:35 Trump Administration
49:02 Upcoming Administrations
53:45 Call to Action
56:55 Closing & Disclaimers
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RESOURCES
Jake Chervinsky
https://x.com/jchervinsky
Amanda Tuminelli
https://x.com/amandatums
DeFi Education Fund
https://www.defieducationfund.org/
Fund Roman Storm
https://freeromanstorm.com/
Fund Alex Pertsev
https://juicebox.money/v2/p/713
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Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here:
https://www.bankless.com/disclosures
The crypto industry is fixated on the U.S. Senate.
On Thursday, lawmakers failed to advance the GENIUS Act, the most significant federal stablecoin bill to date. But the story isn’t over.
Behind the process is a drama about potential presidential conflicts, shifting political alliances, and unresolved policy questions.
In this episode, Kristin Smith, CEO of the Blockchain Association and Amanda Tuminelli, executive director and CLO of the DeFi Education Fund, break down:
Why the bill stalled but isn’t dead yet
The role Trump’s crypto ties are playing
Whether Democrats who once backed crypto are turning away
Why advocates are still pushing for a deal this year
Visit our website for breaking news, analysis, op-eds, articles to learn about crypto, and much more: unchainedcrypto.com
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Kristin Smith, CEO of the Blockchain Association
Amanda Tuminelli, executive director and CLO of the DeFi Education Fund
Timestamps:
👋 0:00 Intro
📉 2:01 Why the Senate blocked the vote but the bill isn’t dead yet
🔄 5:17 Why some pro-crypto Democrats suddenly flipped
⚖️ 8:08 Key differences between the two competing GENIUS Act proposals
🔄 14:18 Whether lawmakers are starting to shift their crypto stances
🤝 16:05 Can the Senate overcome divisions and get this across the finish line?
🏛️ 18:14 How Trump’s crypto ties are shaping the legislative battle
⏳ 20:46 Is the August deadline already slipping out of reach
📝 22:39 Combining stablecoin and market structure bills
🎉 25:59 Why Kristin says it’s a relief not to have to deal with Gensler anymore
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This week, Republican Representatives Tom Emmer and Patrick McHenry sent a letter pressing SEC Chair Gary Gensler for clarity on how securities laws apply to airdrops.
With billions of dollars worth of tokens airdropped this year alone, projects need clarity more than ever.
In this episode, Amanda Tuminelli, Chief Legal Officer of the DeFi Education Fund, dissects the SEC’s stance on airdrops, why her organization believes the SEC has stretched the legal definition of “compensation” too far, and what Congress might ask Gensler in his upcoming hearing.
Plus, she talks about how the SEC “regrets” any confusion it caused for using the term “crypto assets securities,” since the agency now admits that tokens themselves are not securities.
Show highlights:
Why Amanda believes the SEC’s position on airdrops doesn’t make sense
Why the DeFi Education Fund sued the SEC over the BEBA airdrop
How the SEC’s position on airdrops has been clear for a while, but is “wrong” according to Amanda
Her take on users bypassing the geographic restrictions to claim airdrops in the U.S.
How and why the SEC has changed its language around “crypto assets securities”
How the SEC’s new position on crypto assets implicating securities laws seems to rest on the “embodiment” theory
Why Amanda believes the Supreme Court or Congress may be needed to step in
What Amanda expects Congress to question Gary Gensler about in the hearing next week
Amanda’s takeaways from the first Congressional DeFi hearing last week
How she expects the presidential election will impact the regulatory landscape in the U.S.
Visit our website for breaking news, analysis, op-eds, articles to learn about crypto, and much more: unchainedcrypto.com
Thank you to our sponsors!
Coinbase
iTrustCapital
Polkadot
Mantle
Stellar
Guest
Amanda Tuminelli, Chief legal officer of the DeFi Education Fund
Previous appearances on Unchained:
Gary Gensler’s Case Against Uniswap: Does the SEC Even Stand a Chance?
Is This the End of DeFi? Why the US Government Is Going After Tornado Cash
Links
Airdrops:
Blockworks: Republican Reps. ask Gensler for clarity on how securities laws apply to airdrops -
Gabriel Shapiro’s tweet: “We may *disagree* that the position is correct but it's not unclear.”
CoinDesk: Crypto Airdrops Ban U.S. Users, but Americans Are Claiming Tokens Anyway
SEC’s amended complaint in the Binance case
BEBA case
DeFi Education Fund suing the SEC
First Congressional Hearing on DeFi
Unchained: First Congressional Hearing on DeFi Highlights Divide Between Republicans and Democrats
Timestamps:
00:00 Intro
01:42 SEC’s stance on airdrops
04:25 DeFi Education Fund’s lawsuit over BEBA
06:47 Amanda: SEC’s position on airdrops is “wrong”
08:27 Users bypassing geographic restrictions for airdrops
12:47 Why the SEC suddenly apologized for using the term “crypto asset securities” for years
16:47 Amanda’s take on what the SEC’s new theory is for why tokens fall under securities laws
17:43 Why Supreme Court or Congressional involvement is likely needed
19:01 What Congress might ask Gensler in a hearing next week
19:59 Key takeaways from the first Congressional DeFi hearing
20:43 Amanda’s take on how the presidential election might impact crypto
23:45 News Recap
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Fountain, Overcast, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Castbox, Google Podcasts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform.
On Wednesday, the U.S. Securities and Exchange Commission (SEC) issued a Wells notice to Uniswap Labs, the team behind the prominent decentralized exchange (DEX) Uniswap, signaling a forthcoming enforcement action.
Amanda Tuminelli, Chief Legal Officer at the DeFi Education Fund, joined Unchained to unpack what the case could mean for Uniswap and the overall decentralized finance (DeFi) industry.
Amanda also talks about the DeFi Education Fund's recent lawsuit against the SEC over its airdrop policies and the industry’s need for a proactive counteroffensive approach in dealing with the SEC.
Show highlights:
Why Amanda thinks that the SEC is going to take a “kitchen sink approach” to their charges
How the SEC could make a case that some of the tokens traded via Uniswap are securities
What the next steps are in the case, with a lawsuit possibly coming soon
Whether there’s an inconsistency between the SEC’s position and Judge Failla’s rejection of the motion to dismiss the Coinbase lawsuit
How the different components of Uniswap make it hard to prove that Uniswap Labs is responsible for everything that happens on the protocol
Why the DeFi Education Fund recently filed a lawsuit against the SEC
Why Amanda believes in a “proactive counteroffensive strategy” with the SEC
How Amanda would like legislation to be implemented in the U.S.
Why the Tornado Cash developers are not liable for the actions of third parties such as North Korean hackers, according to Amanda
Why Amanda thinks Uniswap will ultimately win against the SEC
Thank you to our sponsors!
iTrustCapital
Polkadot
Guest
Amanda Tuminelli, Chief Legal Officer at DeFi Education Fund
Previous appearance on Unchained: Is This the End of DeFi? Why the US Government Is Going After Tornado Cash
You’ve got a friend in me: How amicus briefs are helping the crypto industry win over the courts, Amanda’s op-ed for Fortune
Links
Wells Notice
Unchained: SEC Puts DeFi in Its Sights With Potential Uniswap Suit
Unchained: UNI Drops 16% as SEC Targets Uniswap Labs
Uniswap Blog Post on the Wells notice
Marvin Ammori Thread on Wells notice
Other cases:
Fortune: Don't blame Uniswap for crypto scams, judge rules—and she's right
The Block: Three crypto advocacy groups file amicus briefs in Tornado Cash developer Roman Storm's case
The DeFiant: SEC Faces Lawsuit Seeking To Exempt Airdrops From Securities Classification
Unchained: Court Rejects Coinbase's Bid to Dismiss SEC Charges Against It
Social media commentary:
Paul Grewal’s tweet on the potential inconsistencies with the Coinbase case.
Gabriel Shapiro’s tweet on how Uniswap AMM smart contracts are not run by the Uniswap company
Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices
While there is always a lot of activity on Crypto Legal Front, this particular moment in time feels especially active. Today on the show we have Jake Chervinsky and Amanda Tuminelli, two of crypto’s most impressive lawyers.
Every single court case, of which there are 5 different ones discussed in this episode today, brings new precedent and new clarity to the crypto space. The theme of this episode today might be… crypto bites back.
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------ TIMESTAMPS 00:00:00 Start 00:05:18 Life as a Crypto lawyer 00:10:20 Coinbase Court Case 00:15:21 Are Airdrops Securities 00:19:34 Amanda's Take 00:22:22 Some Bad News 00:27:32 When Can We Expect Clarity? 00:30:11 Politics vs Policy 00:32:39 SEC vs ETH ETFs 00:36:55 ETH ETF Denial? 00:42:59 SEC Lying? 00:50:41 Leveraging Against Corruption 00:55:17 DeFi Education Fund vs SEC 01:03:56 Roman Storm 01:15:06 Can Courts Remain Impartial? 01:16:57 Elections Impact
------ RESOURCES
Amanda https://twitter.com/amandatums
Jake https://twitter.com/jchervinsky
------ Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here: https://www.bankless.com/disclosures
On Wednesday, the U.S. Government indicted Tornado Cash developers Roman Storm and Roman Semenov for three counts of conspiracy involving a staggeringly large number: $1 billion in criminal proceeds. The U.S. Department of Justice attached North Korean hackers to a large portion of this sum, alleging that Tornado’s privacy tech enabled nefarious deeds. Amanda Tuminelli, chief legal officer of the DeFi Education Fund, joins the show to assess whether the U.S. Government got it right or is merely misguided in its understanding of how blockchain technology works. Should Tornado Cash devs be held to account for the criminal use of their software?
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Stitcher, Castbox, Google Podcasts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform.
Show highlights:
why the U.S. Government says the cofounders of Tornado Cash facilitated money laundering
what the difference is between the concealment of potential proceeds of a crime versus the facilitation of that crime
why Amanda believes that if the government understood the technology they wouldn’t be making these allegations
whether the charges and the indictment will have implications for all software developers
whether these allegations could mark the “end of DeFi” in the U.S.
whether front-end applications in DeFi will need to mandate KYC checks for all users
how the charges appear to contradict earlier FinCEN guidance
how the DOJ will use the involvement of North Korean hackers to “make it look bad” for the jury
what the future of the case will look like and whether there will be a motion to dismiss the indictment
Thank you to our sponsors!
Crypto.com
Arbitrum Foundation
Thales DAO
Guest
Amanda Tuminelli, Chief Legal Officer at DeFi Education Fund
Links
Previous coverage of Unchained on Tornado Cash:
The Chopping Block: 'Code Is Law' Is 'Obviously Not How Anything Works Ever'
The Chopping Block: Why DeFi May Be Over-Complying With Tornado Cash Sanctions
Preston Van Loon on Ethereum’s Merge and His Lawsuit Against Treasury
Given the Sanctions on Tornado Cash, Is Ethereum Censorship Resistant?
The Chopping Block: Did OFAC Overstep by Sanctioning Tornado Cash?
Tornado Cash Sanctioned. Did the Government Overstep Its Bounds?
Unchained:
Tornado Cash Cofounder Arrested, Another Sanctioned by U.S. Government
OFAC Updates Tornado Cash Sanctions To Include DAO
Coin Center Sues the US Treasury Over Tornado Cash Sanctions
Coin Center: New Tornado Cash indictments seem to run counter to FinCEN guidance
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Joining us today are the best in the biz Chervinsky & Amanda Tuminelli who are here to answer all our questions about the SEC and it's assault on the crypto industry as a whole. ------ 📣 ASYMETRIX | STAKE stETH NOW https://bankless.cc/asymetrix-pod
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------ CHAPTERS 0:00 Intro 6:05 Who are Jake and Amanda? 8:08 Breaking Down This Historical Moment 11:19 The SEC Never Wanted Crypto To Win 14:56 Why Is Gary So Confident? 18:43 David's Conspiracy Theory 23:52 What if Gary Actually Wins? 31:07 Clarity From The Court Date? 35:01 Does Gary Just Want the Fame? 36:49 Why The SEC Rejects Public Process 38:34 Is This Un-Constitutional? 44:06 Jake's Optimistic Take 48:14 The Digital Asset Bill 52:44 How YOU Can Take Action ----- Not financial or tax advice. This channel is strictly educational and is not investment advice or a solicitation to buy or sell any assets or to make any financial decisions. This video is not tax advice. Talk to your accountant. Do your own research.
Disclosure. From time-to-time I may add links in this newsletter to products I use. I may receive commission if you make a purchase through one of these links. Additionally, the Bankless writers hold crypto assets. See our investment disclosures here: https://www.bankless.com/disclosures