How Crypto Neobanks Work: Frax, Cards, and Visa’s Role | Sam Kazemian
Neobanks might be the quiet coordination hack that makes Visa optional. David sits down with Frax’s Sam Kazemian to map the new payment stack: why cards today settle over Visa yet still onboard users into stablecoins, how Frax USD (payments) pairs with sFRAX USD (savings), and why Ethereum remains the “savings/issuance” base while specialized payment chains battle for flows. Sam unpacks Frax’s white-label issuance strategy and RWA plumbing, shares an institutional DD story that highlights reliability over hype, and lays out the metrics that actually matter—card acceptance, bank deposits, chain coverage, and real-world spend. If you’re tracking how stablecoins, neobanks, and RWAs converge into an on-chain economy, this one connects the pipes.
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TIMESTAMPS
0:00 Intro
0:54 What Is a Neobank
2:45 Crypto Neobanks & Frax’s Two-Coin Model
5:28 Strategy: Be the Pipes, Not the Card
14:48 Design: RWAs On-Chain & Compliance Surface
18:16 Cards Today, Native Pay Tomorrow
28:52 The Standards Fight
33:30 Institutional Proof Point & Growth Curve
40:28 Closed-Loop On-Chain Economy
55:36 What to Track Next
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RESOURCES
Sam Kazemian
https://x.com/samkazemian
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Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here:
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Bits + Bips: Hyperliquid’s USDH Bidding War & Why the DAT Model Is Broken - Ep. 900
The fight for Hyperliquid’s USDH stablecoin is more than a ticker battle—it’s a referendum on how crypto distribution, governance, and incentives will shape the next trillion-dollar market.
In this episode of Bits + Bips, Steve Ehrlich sits down with Delta Blockchain Fund’s Kavita Gupta, Galaxy Digital’s Alex Thorn, and Frax founder Sam Kazemian to dig into the big questions: Who will win the USDH war, and why does distribution matter more than design? Are DATs fulfilling their promises—or raising money without accountability? Why are L2s the wrong place for tokenized stocks? And where exactly is the trillion-dollar opportunity in stablecoins?
Sponsors:
Xapo
Walrus
Host:
Steve Ehrlich, Executive Editor at Unchained
Guests:
Kavita Gupta, Founder & Managing Partner of Delta Blockchain Fund
Alex Thorn, Head of Firmwide Research at Galaxy Digital
Sam Kazemian, Founder of Frax Finance
Links:
Unchained:
The Competition Is On. Who’ll Win the USDH Ticker on Hyperliquid?
Stablecoin Issuers Enter Bidding War to Launch Hyperliquid’s USDH
Sky Joins Bidding War to Launch Hyperliquid’s USDH
Timestamps:
🎬 0:00 Intro
🔥 4:17 The bidding war for Hyperliquid’s USDH
🗳️ 25:12 Whether the Hyperliquid DAO is truly decentralized
⚠️ 29:22 Are DATs already broken as a product?
🌶️ 35:00 How some DATs avoid fulfilling their promises after raising money
📈 40:27 Why yield-maximization is critical for DATs—and what risks it creates
💵 53:22 Where the trillion-dollar opportunity in stablecoins might actually be
🏛️ 55:35 Why tokenized stocks belong on L1s, not L2s
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Ethereum’s Biggest Mistake (and How to Fix It) | Sam Kazemian
Ethereum has achieved groundbreaking technological success, but has it failed to properly define ETH the asset?
In this episode, Frax founder Sam Kazemian joins us to discuss what he believes is Ethereum’s biggest mistake: confusing the ETH asset with Ethereum the technology. Sam argues that post-EIP-1559 and Proof of Stake, ETH unintentionally shifted toward a discounted cash flow (DCF) valuation model, undermining its potential as a commodity-like store of value.
We explore how the Ethereum community can reclaim a stronger narrative around ETH and why social consensus — not just tech — determines an asset’s destiny.
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TIMESTAMPS
0:00 Intro
4:43 Classifying ETH
17:50 ETH/BTC Collapse
33:39 ETH Revenues
44:35 Blue-Money Gospel
53:44 What ETH Needs
1:10:08 ETH Internet Bond Narrative
1:19:49 Final Thoughts
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RESOURCES
Sam Kazemian
https://x.com/samkazemian
Blue-Money Gospel
https://x.com/RyanSAdams/status/1915874994514452763
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Not financial or tax advice. See our investment disclosures here:
https://www.bankless.com/disclosures
Sam Kazemian on FraxUSD and the Future of Stablecoins in Decentralized Finance
Sam Kazemian, founder of Frax Finance, outlined the development and goals of FraxUSD, a decentralized stablecoin designed to integrate with both traditional finance and decentralized ecosystems. The upgraded FraxUSD offers redeemability through custodians like BlackRock and SuperState while providing competitive yields through diversified strategies. Kazemian described Frax’s broader vision as building a digital economy anchored by its flagship stablecoin and Fraxstool, a high-performance Ethereum Layer 2.
Chapters
00:00 - Introduction
00:48 - Founding Story and Differentiation of Frax
02:01 - Vision for Decentralized Stablecoins
02:41 - Features of FraxUSD
08:51 - Best of Both Worlds Design for FraxUSD
13:08 - Future of Stablecoins
23:05 - Yield Strategy of FraxUSD
34:16 - FraxUSD in Real World and On-Chain Usage
42:02 - Stablecoins as the Gateway to Crypto
47:12 - Roadmap and Future of Frax
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What Does the Curve Crisis Say About DeFi? - Ep. 527
While it’s now mostly contained, the Curve crisis has exposed some of the systemic risks in the world of DeFi. Sam Kazemian, founder of Frax Finance, joins the show to discuss what DeFi needs to do to get better – and what builders should learn from a novel attack that was ultimately about much more than $50 million in drained funds.
Listen to the episode on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, Overcast, Podcast Addict, Pocket Casts, Stitcher, Castbox, Google Podcasts, Amazon Music, or on your favorite podcast platform.
Show highlights:
how the Curve exploit occurred and why this hack is different
how the attack triggered a crisis in major lending platforms like Aave, Fraxlend, and Abracadabra
what Curve founder Michael Egorov’s solution was to the potential liquidation of his several loans
whether this situation proves that DeFi is not as good as promised
what can be done to prevent these kinds of issues in the future, particularly with large loans in DeFi that could potentially bring down the ecosystem
Thank you to our sponsors!
Crypto.com
Railgun DAO
Arbitrum Foundation
Thales DAO
Guest
Sam Kazemian, founder of Frax Finance
Links
Previous coverage on the Curve hack: The Chopping Block: Who’s to Blame for the Curve Hack?
Unchained:
$52 Million Drained in Curve Finance Pools Exploit
Curve Founder’s Liquidation Could Trigger Chaos for DeFi
Curve Exploit Results in Largest MEV Block Rewards in Ethereum’s History
CoinDesk:
Curve Founder Deploys New Liquidity Pool to Address FRAX Debt Situation
Spooked by Curve Liquidation Threat, DeFi Protocols Shore Up Defenses
Aave Should Block Curve Token Borrowing, Risk Management Firm Proposes
After the Curve Attack: What's Next for DeFi?
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Frax: Building the DeFi Trinity | Sam Kazemian
In this episode of Empire, Sam Kazemian joins Jason and Dan to discuss Frax's mission to build the most widely used stablecoins in DeFi. Sam starts by explaining how Frax has succeeded while other stable protocols have failed, why Frax is eyeing Fed deposits and the strategy behind the "DeFi Trinity". We then explore Frax's new ETH staking product, the stablecoin trilemma, and Sam drops a new product announcement (alpha leak). Don't miss this conversation with one of the brightest minds in DeFi!
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Timestamps:
(00:00) Introduction
(00:49) - Frax’s Mission
(04:41) - How Frax Thrived When Others Failed
(09:00) - Fed Deposits, Escaping Regulation and RWAs
(17:03) - Public ad
(18:53) - Creating Spot Demand and Monetary Premium
(26:00) - frxETH and sfrxETH Explained
(44:31) - Is Frax’s Focus too Broad?
(49:02) - The Stablecoin Trilemma
(54:00) - Alpha Leak
(55:46) - Update on Frax’s Multisig
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Follow Sam: https://twitter.com/samkazemian?lang=en
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This episode is sponsored by Public.com. Go to https://Public.com/empire to move your cash into a Treasury Account today.
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Resources
Frax
https://frax.finance/
- -
Disclaimer: Nothing said on Empire is a recommendation to buy or sell securities or tokens. This podcast is for informational purposes only, and any views expressed by anyone on the show are solely our opinions, not financial advice. Santiago, Jason, and our guests may hold positions in the companies, funds, or projects discussed.
FRAX & the 4pool Curve Takeover | Sam Kazemian
Sam Kazemian is the founder of Frax, the fractional-algorithmic stablecoin protocol. After co-founding the decentralized Wikipedia startup Everipedia, Sam set out to pioneer the algorithmic stablecoin space. The FRAX stablecoin now has a market cap of over $2.6 billion, and the protocol’s FXS governance token is up 300% in the last year.
In this episode, we explore the Stablecoin Wars, in which different protocols compete for liquidity and composability in DeFi. Sam brings a 1st-person perspective into the developments surrounding UST and the recently launched 4pool on Curve, which consists of stablecoins UST, FRAX, USDT, and USDC.
A highlight of this conversation is Sam’s parable of an archetypal central bank, in which he cruises through a number of salient takes on money markets and macroeconomics. There is a lot to learn about this Cambrian explosion of financial technology, and Sam is a great teacher. Stick around to find out why walked away from this conversation bullish on Frax.
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------ Topics Covered:
0:00 Intro 3:30 Sam from Frax 7:50 The Stablecoin Narrative 13:45 The Central Bank Parable 24:45 Backing an Exchange Rate
28:10 Frax Analytics | What is Frax? 37:34 Frax Analytics | The Peg 42:30 Frax Analytics | Comparing 45:03 RSA Gets Frax-Pilled
49:42 MIM vs UST 53:16 The LUNA Token 56:41 Frax Roadmap | FPI
1:04:36 The 4pool 1:14:00 The Stablecoin Wars 1:18:35 What Happens Next? 1:23:20 Closing & Disclaimers
------ Resources:
Sam on Twitter https://twitter.com/samkazemian
Frax Finance https://app.frax.finance/
Decentralized Finance and the Debt Cycles https://academy.blue-swan.io/blog/decentralized-finance-and-the-debt-cycles
Market Share Chart https://www.theblockcrypto.com/data/decentralized-finance/stablecoins/total-crypto-backed-and-algorithmic-stablecoin-supply
Do Kwon’s 4pool Tweet https://twitter.com/stablekwon/status/1510021707377287170
----- Not financial or tax advice. This channel is strictly educational and is not investment advice or a solicitation to buy or sell any assets or to make any financial decisions. This video is not tax advice. Talk to your accountant. Do your own research.
Disclosure. From time-to-time I may add links in this newsletter to products I use. I may receive commission if you make a purchase through one of these links. Additionally, the Bankless writers hold crypto assets. See our investment disclosures here: https://newsletter.banklesshq.com/p/bankless-disclosures